Giants in the Historical Record

This chapter will look at variations of hominids and hominin types, and their relationship to their antediluvian predecessors. Of particular interest are the Peruvian “Elongated Skulls, and other hominid types including the Starchild Skull. This chapter will also document the case that surviving giants and other (derivative) hominid types lived in isolated (declining) small groups up into the Early Common Era.

Introduction to Giants

Across the last (at least) 6,000 years, records indicate the presence of medium sized giant hominids up through the post Colombian period. In this chapter we will explore historical (reported) records of humans of giant stature

This section will look at the evidence of both oral and written records, as well as artifacts, bones and full skeletons that substantiate the actual existence of those post-glacial mid or smaller sized giants. (Much larger than modern man, but not nearly as large as earlier Epoch Giants) The records and artifacts suggest current Epoch giant hominids up through the post Colombian era were the smaller of the giants, standing between 8' to 13' in height, and weighing between 850 and 3200 lbs.

The records indicate that giants from the Last Great Cataclysm were between 16' and 24' tall. Following that cataclysm, giants decreased in size down to 12' to 15' during the later Holocene about 3,500 years ago. One of the survivor groups of larger giants had nearly gone extinct, a remnant tribe living in the Valley of Bashan, in the foothills of Mt. Hermon in Northern Israel, near the Beqaa Valley.

Below is a modern giant from the Roman Era, Maximinus Thrax, also known as the Holy Roman Emperor; "Maximinus". Maximinus was probably the biggest man ever to hold the office of Roman Emperor.

This image of Maximinus Thrax is from Wikimedia Commons and is used with permission

The Historian Augustus has it that Maximus was 8' 6” (2.6 m) tall, and so strong that he could pull laden carts unaided! The size of his footwear was also legendary, and the expression "Maximinus's Boot" came to be used in popular parlance for any tall or lanky individual.

Surviving portrait busts, such as this one from the Louvre, show Maximinus as a heavy muscled man with powerful jaw and closed-cropped hair, the image of a seasoned soldier. Not for him the meditative, spiritual pose favored by Alexander Severus.

Although not going into the supposedly detailed portions of Historian Augusta, the historian Herodias, a contemporary of Maximinus, mentions him as a man of greater size, noting that: "He was in any case a man of such frightening appearance and colossal size that there is no obvious comparison to be drawn with any of the best-trained Greek athletes or warrior elite of the barbarians. In any case, he was much larger, heavier and stronger than any others in the Roman Court, including Gladiators, and slave Barbarians.

Patagonian Giants

This drawing is an image from Wikimedia Commons.

Antonio Pigafetta —a Venetian nobleman— joined the expedition of Magellan as the official chronicler of the voyage. Pigafetta kept a richly detailed diary of the expedition in which he made entries every day of the entire odyssey. Pigafetta said that one of the reasons for joining the expedition was to gain some fame for posterity.

Here is an excerpt from Pigafetta’s diary:

"Leaving that place, we finally reached 49 and one-half degrees toward the Antarctic Pole. As it was winter, the ships entered a safe port to winter. We passed two months in that place without seeing anyone. One day we suddenly saw a naked man of giant stature on the shore of the port, dancing, singing, and throwing dust on his head. The captain general sent one of our men to the giant so that he might perform the same actions as a sign of peace. Having done that, the man led the giant to an islet into the presence of the captain-general. When the giant was in the captain-general's and our presence, he marveled greatly, and made signs with one finger raised upward, believing that we had come from the sky. He was so tall that we reached only to his waist, and he was well proportioned.

His face was large and painted red all over, while about his eyes he was painted yellow; and he had two hearts painted on the middle of his cheeks. His scanty hair was painted white. He was dressed in the skins of animals skillfully sewn together. That animal has a head and ears as large as those of a mule, a neck and body like those of a camel, the legs of a deer, and the tail of a horse, like which it neighs, and that land has very many of them. His feet were shod with the same kind of skins which covered his feet in the manner of shoes. In his hand he carried a short, heavy bow, with a cord somewhat thicker than those of the lute, and made from the intestines of the same animal, and a bundle of rather short cane arrows feathered like ours, and with points of white and black flint stones in the manner of Turkish arrows, instead of iron. Those points were fashioned by means of another stone." (Diary of Pigafetta, pp. 51-52).

It is significant to note that the above narrative is taken from the journal of the 'Official Chronicler' of Magellan's voyage of discovery. That is the one person above all others, who is tasked with recording and keeping the most accurate records of events, activities, etc. whether exotic or mundane. This person is not only responsible to the Commander of the voyage, but also to King and Country for his eye witness accounts as a complete, precise and accurate testimony of events that occurred during the voyage. Based on his position and responsibilities alone, his first hand eye witness testimony of encounters with 10' giants MUST be taken as factual information by an unimpeachable witness. To do otherwise, is to trivialize the importance of the Chronicler's fundamental accountability.

Historical Text References to Giants

The Book of Giants was a work apparently composed in Syriac (an eastern dialect of Aramaic). The book was entirely lost until the twentieth century, although a few scant references to it survived in Latin, Greek, and Arabic, indicating that it involved battles of the ancient giants. Then about a century ago many highly fragmentary Manichean works written in Central Asian languages were recovered archaeologically at Turfan, in China (and much of the find remains unpublished even at present). The Dead Sea Scrolls contain fragments of the 'Book of Giants'.

This manuscript fragment is an image from Wikimedia Commons and is used with permission.

The Epic of Gilgamesh: What is claimed as the oldest surviving epic-story in the world; 'The Epic of Gilgamesh' also includes references to giants. Gilgamesh and Enkidu go together to fight the evil Humbaba at the cedar mountains. (Mt. Hermon in the Beqaa Valley, Lebanon) The evil giants face was like a lion, a roar like a flood, a mouth of flames, breath that burns trees, and teeth like a dragons. In the end they cut off his head.

Herodotus in Book 1, Chapter 68: Describes how the Spartans uncovered in Tegea the body of Orestes which was seven cubits long -- around 10 feet. In his book, 'The Comparison of Romulus with Theseus' Plutarch describes how the Athenians uncovered the body of Theseus, which was of more than ordinary size.

The kneecaps of Ajax were exactly the size of a discus for the boy's pentathlon, wrote Pausanias. A boy's discus was about twelve centimeters in diameter, while a normal adult patella is around five centimeters, suggesting Ajax may have been around 14 feet tall.

Pliny: The Arabian giant Gabara was 9 feet 9 inches. This Arabian giant is mentioned by Pliny, who says he was the tallest man seen in the days of Claudius.

Andronicus II: was 10 feet in height. He was grandson of Alexius Comnnus Nictas.

Elea'zer: was 7 cubits (nearly 10.5 feet). Vitellius sent this giant to Rome; and he is mentioned by Josephus. (Josephus speaks of a Jew 10 feet 2 inches).

Biblical references to giants:

Genesis 6:4; …there were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

1 Chronicles 20:6; And yet again there was war at Gath, where was a man of great stature, whose fingers and toes were four and twenty, six on each hand, and six on each foot and he also was the son of the giant.

1 Chronicles 20:8; There were born unto the giant in Gath; and they fell by the hand of David, and by the hand of his servants.

Deuteronomy 1:28; “Whither shall we go up? Our brethren have discouraged our heart, saying, the people are greater and taller than we; the cities are great and walled up to heaven; and moreover we have seen the sons of the Anakims there.”

Deuteronomy 2:11; …which also were accounted giants, as the Anakims; but the Moabites called them Emims.

Deuteronomy 2:20; …giants dwelt therein in old time; and the Ammonites call them Zamzummims;

Deuteronomy 3:11; …for only OG, king of Bashan remained of the remnant of giants; behold his bedstead was a bedstead of iron; is it not in Rabbath of the children of Ammon? Nine cubits was the length thereof, and four cubits the breadth of it, after the cubit of a man. (ibid: 13' long and 6' wide)

Deuteronomy 3:13; And the rest of Gilead, and all Bashan, being the kingdom of Og, gave I unto the half tribe of Manasseh; all the region of Argob, with all Bashan, which was called the land of giants.

Joshua 12:4; …and the coast of OG, king of Bashan, which was of the remnant of the giants that dwelt at Ashtaroth and at Edrei.

Joshua 13:12; …all the kingdom of OG in Bashan, which reigned in Ashtaroth and in Edrei, who remained of the remnant of the giants: for these did Moses smite, and cast them out.

Joshua 15:8; And the border went up by the valley of the son of Hinnom unto the south side of the Jebusite; the same is Jerusalem: and the border went up to the top of the mountain that lieth before the valley of Hinnom westward, which is at the end of the valley of the giants northward:

Joshua 17:15; And Joshua answered them, “If thou be a great people, then get thee up to the wood country, and cut down for thyself there in the land of the Perizzites and of the giants, if mount Ephraim be too narrow for thee”.

Joshua 18:16; And the border came down to the end of the mountain that lieth before the valley of the son of Hinnom, and which is in the valley of the giants on the north, and descended to the valley of Hinnom, to the side of Jebusi on the south, and descended to Enrogel.

Numbers 13:33; ANAK, father of the Anakim. ”The Hebrew spies said they were mere grass-hoppers in comparison with these giants.” (3)

1 Samuel 17:4; And there went out a champion out of the camp of the Philistines, named Goliath, of Gath, whose height was six cubits and a span.

1 Samuel 21:16; And Ishbibenob, which was of the sons of the giant, the weight of whose spear weighed three hundred shekels of brass in weight, he being girded with a new sword, thought to have slain David.

2 Samuel 21:18; …and it came to pass after this, that there was again a battle with the Philistines at Gob: then Sibbechai the Hushathite slew Saph, which was of the sons of the giant.

2 Samuel 21:20; And there was yet a battle in Gath, where was a man of great stature, that had on every hand six fingers, and on every foot six toes, four and twenty in number; and he also was born to the giant.

2 Samuel 21:22; …these four were born to the giant in Gath, and fell by the hand of David, and by the hand of his servants.

1 Chronicles 20:4; And it came to pass after this, that there arose war at Gezer with the Philistines; at which time Sibbechai the Hushathite slew Sippai, that was of the children of the giants: and they were subdued.

Over 20 direct references to Giants, their localities and families in the early biblical texts means their actual physical presence is factually and historically recorded.

Based on the above history, we will review the Cities of Bashan, the Capital City of OG, King of Bashan.

A note about 'Cubit' measurement; the 'Cubit' defines a precise unit measurement of length used throughout the period as a recognizable and valid measurement for trade purposes. It was acknowledged by all trading partners as a standard unit of measure. Actually, both Sumerian and Egyptian 'cubits' had two measurements, one a 'common' measurement of 18”, and the other a 'Royal' measurement of 20.4”. The 'common' cubit is recognized by most scholars as the unit of measure in Biblical texts. That is how Goliath's 'six cubits and a span is converted to 9'9” in height. (A 'span' is exactly half a common cubit, or 9”.) This measurement goes back in time when the ‘span’ of a man’s hand, (with his fingers spread out, averaged about 9” for an average sized man when measured (with fingers spread completely wide open) from the tip of the little finger to the tip of the thumb.) A common cubit was a “double span,” or both hands touching at the thumbs spread wide. The later measurement of a “yard” is “two double spans.”

Individual Giants referenced in the Old Testament

Numbers 12:28 – Anak, Father of a Clan of Giants living in Canaan.

Joshua 15:32, 21:11 – Arba, forefather of Anak and the Anakim.

Joshua 15:14, Judges 1:10, 20 – Ahiman, a descendant of Arba and Anak who lived in Kiriath-Arba, later called 'Hebron'.

Numbers 13:10 …one of three giants driven out of Hebron by Caleb.

Deuteronomy 2:10; 2 Sam 21:16,18,20,22; 1 Chronicles 20:4,6,8 – Rapha, early ancestor of all the giant clans in Palestine-Bashan, including Anakites, Emites and Horites.

Joshua 15:15 - Sepher, another Anakites patriarch like Arba.

Deuteronomy 3:1-11 – OG, the King of Bashan, identified as the last of “the Rephaites” is the largest giant referenced. OG ruled near Mount Hermon, where according to Enoch, Angels sired the Nephilim. OG’s army was defeated and he was killed by the Israelites near Edrei, while the Army was still commanded by Moses.

Joshua 15:14, Jud 1:10, 20 – Seshai, a descendant of Arba and Anak who lived in Kiriath-Arba, later called 'Hebron'.

Numbers 13:10 – Talmai, was a descendant of Arba and Anak who lived in Kiriath-Arba, later called 'Hebron'.

Joshua 15:14, Judges 1:10, 20 - One of three giants driven out of Hebron by Caleb.

1 Sam 17:4; Josh 11:22 - Goliath was descendant from the Anakim giants and champion of the Philistines. He was about 9' 9” tall, wore armor weighing 125 lbs., his spearhead weighed 15 lbs.

1 Chronicles 20:5; 2 Sam 21:19 – Lahmi, a brother of Goliath, from Gath. Used a spear similar to one used by Goliath.

2 Sam 21:15-27: 22 - Ishbi-Benob was a giant living in Gath with the Philistines in southern Canaan. He was killed by David's nephew Abishai in a battle between Israelites and Philistines. His spearhead was 7.5 lbs., half the size of Goliath's spearhead.

1 Chronicles 20:4, 8:2, Sam 21:18-22 - Saph or Sappai, another giant who lived with the Philistines in Gath. He was killed by one of David's men: 'Sibbachai the Hushathite'.

2 Sam 21:10-22; 1 Chronicles 20:6-8 – An unnamed giant with 6 fingers on each hand, and 6 toes on each foot.

The following is a chart of the Tribes and Clans of Giants from Bashan - Mount Hermon.

The following data and information documents the modern era re-discovery of many cities of Bashan by the 19th Century Explorer, Josiah Porter. The account is taken from his book ' The Giant Cities of Bashan' published in 1882.

Bashan, City of Giants

The ancient territory of Bashan now lies in southern Lebanon, western Syria, and part of the disputed Golan Heights. How could a province measuring not more than 30 by 20 miles (50 by 32 kilometers) support the reported number of fortified cities, especially when the greater part of it was a wilderness of rock? But, mysterious and incredible as this seems, the cities built and occupied 4,000 years ago by giants exist even yet.

Nineteenth century explorer, Josiah Porter, traversed their empty streets; he opened doors of their houses; he slept peacefully in their long-deserted halls. From a tower in one of them, Salcah, Porter counted some 30 towns and villages dotting the surface of the plain.

This drawing-reproduction is from the book “The Giant City of Bashan and Syria's Holy Places" by J.L. Porter, 1877

He reports: "On the spot, with my own eyes, I have seen that it is literally true. The cities are there to this day. Some of them retain the ancient names recorded in the Old Testament”.

These 'cities' are really walled towns normally only about a hectare (2½ acres) in area. They appear to be scattered around the ancient fortress just outside El Khodor, which is built on a high volcanic plug. This fortress has been built and rebuilt several times since, but there is plenty of evidence of really ancient foundations and structures dating well before the Roman ruins, which are very obvious. I imagine that King OG (referred to in Numbers 21) ruled from this fortress.

These ancient cities contain probably the very oldest complete specimens of domestic architecture now existing in the world. Various Bible writers describe Bashan as almost an earthly paradise - the strength and grandeur of its oaks, the beauty of its mountain scenery, the unrivaled luxuriance of its pastures, the fertility of its wide-spreading plains and the excellence of its cattle. Remnants of the oak forests still clothe the mountainsides. Ancient Bashan comprises a vast field of basalt, elevated some 30 feet above the plain. It is called the "Lejah.” Here stood the giant cities. Surrounding it was the fertile plain of Bashan.

This drawing-reproduction is from the book “The Giant City of Bashan and Syria's Holy Places" by J.L. Porter, 1877.

Some of the buildings in the city of Bozrah would grace the proudest modern Western city. These ancient streets are paved - still perfect, not a stone out of place. Even the walls of houses are up to eight feet thick, built of large squared blocks of basalt, without cement. The roofs are made of basalt slabs, cut like planks and reaching from wall to wall. Heavy slabs form the ceilings. The very doors and window-shutters are of stone. The massive doors hang upon pivots, working in sockets, as do the window-shutters. The black basalt used is almost as hard as iron. Porter measured doors 9 feet high by 4½ feet wide and 10 inches thick. In one door was seen a place for a massive lock. The doors are tastefully ornamented with panels and garlands of fruit and flowers, sculptured in relief.

Rooms inside many private houses measure as much as 20 feet in height. Here are huge rooms and apartments in perfect preservation. One by one, Porter entered some of these old houses, went upstairs, and visited the rooms. Moss grows over the ruins. Groups of tapering columns spring up from the dense foliage of the oaks. Luxuriant creepers twist around the pillars.

This drawing-reproduction is from the book “The Giant City of Bashan and Syria's Holy Places" by J.L. Porter, 1877.

Brambles grow in festoons over the doorways. Branches of trees shoot through gaping cracks in some old walls. Owls flap their wings and foxes and jackals scamper along the streets. When Porter explored this area, he was stunned. So perfect was every street, every house, every room - so perfect, yet not a sound. Huge houses built among wild rocks, hundreds of houses per city, still perfect, but not a man to dwell in them.

This drawing-reproduction is from the book (J. Porter, The Giant Cities of Bashan, T. Nelson and Son, London, 1882

The rocks are black, the soil is black, the buildings are all black - but not gloomy. The grass is green, the oak foliage, glittering in the sun, is brilliant. The private houses bear the marks of the most remote antiquity. They leave us to conclude that the cities were built by giants - a race of giants that has been extinct for more than 3,000 years.

Porter noted that the highways of Bashan were still in place, completely covered here and there, with the branches of oak trees and straggling brambles.

"There is plenty of evidence of ancient black basalt 'cities', mostly within modern townships, which are integrated with the ruins. Some of the evidence is very good, including the high-arched doorway into a large house in Al Harisah, which has cleverly designed, high-arched stone ceilings. It supports a new house which has just been plonked on top, with livestock and accumulating debris occupying the rooms below.

This drawing-reproduction is from the book “The Giant City of Bashan and Syria's Holy Places" by J.L. Porter, 1877.

It is painfully clear that a remnants of Giants lived in the city of Bashan and surrounding area of what is now Bozrah and the Beqaa Valley, and that the historic record supports the narrative of families of giants (including linage narrative) lived in the area of Mt. Hermon and the Beqaa Valley at the time of Moses and Joshua

The narrative states clearly the giants were descendants of remnants of the Nephilim (Rapha - Rephaites) before the great flood.

Much more detailed descriptions are available from J. Porter’s book on Bashan.

Other Giant Related Anomalies

It seems that everything in the fossil record was larger in the past than it is today. The environmental conditions of that early world would support plant and animal life of fantastic size and numbers. In fact, the fossil record shows that all terrestrial life has decreased in physical size, height, and weight. The largest members of the animal kingdom are either becoming extinct, or shrinking in size. Humanoids, plants, mammals, and reptiles were often two or three times the size of their current counterparts.

There were kangaroos as large as today's hippopotamuses, with skulls a meter long. Sheep were as big as today's horses. Frogs were 6 to 10 feet, with heads half a meter long - and jaws more powerful than those of a modern ox.

Fossil eagles have been found; these birds had 40 foot wingspans and were 12 feet in length. Oh yes, and lobsters 6 feet (2 meters) long.

Australian koalas were as big as rhinos. In the northwest of South Australia, between 500 and 1000 skeletons were found of a colossal wombat as large as a rhinoceros. It was given the name 'Diprotodon'.

In New Zealand zoologists from Christchurch chipped out of a cave roof the fossil skeleton of a penguin 7 feet tall.

On the Matakaoa foreshore, near Te Araroa, were found preserved prints of a huge animal. The prints extended for some distance. Some were 28 inches in breadth. Personnel at the Dominion Museum suggested the tracks might be those of either the Megatherium or the Labrynthodon, huge mammals estimated to have weighed up to 30 tons.

The Assistant-Director of the Auckland Institute and Museum wrote an article for the Auckland Star and objected to the foregoing information, since "such a statement is not in accordance with the modern scientific view of evolution and of geology."

It was believed that New Zealand's wildlife had evolved in isolation independently from the rest of the world, hence its uniqueness. But if this were so, then these giants must have evolved parallel with the same giants INDEPENDENTLY in more than one place. This stretched credulity to the limit.

In North and South America fossil crocodiles have been found in the rocks up to 18 meters (54 feet) long. Present-day Australian crocs are small by comparison and grow only to 6 meters (20 feet) long, and that is awesome enough.

The coalfields around Manchester and Newcastle (UK) as well as those in Pennsylvania and Alabama (USA), contain giant fossil horse tail rush plants as tall as a five story building. Today horse tails plague British and USA gardens at only 45 cm (18 inches) tall. The common Tassel fern found in Australia and other countries grows only a few feet tall, but in the rocks its fossil ancestors are over 30 meters (100 feet) tall. Alongside such giant preserved plants are fossil cockroaches, forty times bigger than the ones we see today.

On a Nova Scotia field trip led by Australian John Mackay, a giant fossil slater or wood louse was photographed. This monster has been found on both sides of the Atlantic Ocean amongst fossil trees in the coal fields of Nova Scotia and Western Scotland. The fossil was so well preserved that its stomach contents were intact. There is no difficulty in identifying it as a giant member of the wood lice or roly-poly family which is still here with us. They used to be nearly 2 meters (6 feet) long. Today they are only about ½ inch (1 centimeter) long.

A huge fossil ammonite was discovered on the west coast of New Zealand. It is nearly 2 meters (6 feet) across. This giant shellfish's only known present day cousin is the Nautilus shell, which measures from 5 to 25 centimeters (2 to 10 inches).

Says English scientist Alfred Russell Wallace: 

"It is quite clear, therefore, that we live in a zoologically impoverished world, from which all the hugest and fiercest and strangest forms have disappeared." (The Geographical Distribution of Animals, pp.150, 151)

 Even Charles Darwin was astonished to discover that

“.. now we find mere pigmies compared with the antecedent allied races." (Sir Henry Howarth, The Mammoth and the Flood, p. 351)

Reports of Giants around the World

Traditions drawn from the racial memory of races worldwide state that the very first people on earth were mighty and of immense stature, but that they later degenerated in size and vigor.

For example, the present day Kotoko people of Chad, Africa, claim that their ancestors were giants. "In those days men were so tall they could look over the trees," they say.

"Men twice as tall as us" once inhabited the "realm of delight,” claim stories of old China, but they lost it by not living "by laws of virtue.”

“God was angry with the giants,” say the Montagnais Indians of Canada, and sent a flood upon them.

It is a fact that the whole world seems to enshrine ancestral memories of giants. One could cite scores of such legends, from everywhere. Here are some of them:

Europe

Nordic Myths: The Jotunn were great giants.

Scandinavia: The first men of creation were as big as mountains.

German Myths: Permanently preoccupied with giants are the myths of the Germanic tribes.

Goths: The giants were drowned in the Deluge. The survivors fathered a race of giants.

Celtic Legends: The Gargantuan giants.

Ireland: Stories of giants called Fomorians.

British Legends: Gog and Magog and Albion, the giant-god. That a race of giants roamed the earth ages ago seems to be indicated by the discovery of stone tools at Norfolk, England which were apparently wielded by pre-historic giants. As the giant tools were found in strata that underlies glacial deposits, researches are sure it was produced and used by a race that predated the Ice Age.

Credit the Mica E. Giantology website, used with permission.

Claudius Aelianus (2nd century): On Atlantis were "men twice as tall as those common to our climate, and they lived twice as long."

Greek Legends: The Titans, who some said were the first men on earth, were great giants. The Cyclopes were of immense stature and said to be the builders of the enormous masonry in Greece, Italy, and certain other areas of the globe.

Sicily: Enceladus, the giant who warred with Zeus, was buried under Mt Etna. Typhoeus, a giant of a mountain chain of Asia Minor, was also buried at Mt Etna. The giant Lestrigons was said to have dwelt in Sicily.

Africa:

Chad: There once lived in the Chad region black giants with smooth hair, from whom the present tribes are descended. (Legends of the present day Kotoko tribe) "The enormous piles of large stone blocks near Goulfei were transported there by the Sao, men so tall that they could look over the trees." (Same tribe)

Asia:

Chaldea: The Izdubar were giants.

Babylonians: "The ancient Babylon was founded by giants saved from the Deluge." The Babylonian Talmud mentions a prehistoric race of giants who had double rows of teeth.

Apochrypha of Baruch: There were 4,090,000 giants before the Flood.

India Myths and Legends: The Danavas and Daityas were giants, as were the Rakshasas of the Hindu epic.

Tibet: Giants play an important part in the mythology of Tibet. The medical lamasery in Tibet claims that long ago Tibet was peopled by a giant race (males averaging 15 feet in height; females averaging 12 feet in height).

Thai Tradition: The earliest men were of colossal size.

Australian-Pacific:

Aboriginal, Australia: The secret city of Burrunga in Australia's northern hinterlands was inhabited by gigantic white men with red hair. There are many traditions of giant men and women who lived far back in the "dreamtime."

Maoris, New Zealand: Tamatekapua, lord of the Arawa Maori migration, now buried on Mt. Moehau, Coromandel Peninsula, was 9 feet tall.

Papua, New Guinea: Traditional stories of the Vella area of Papua New Guinea tell of a group of Europeans who tried to colonize the area a few centuries ago. They attempted to build a temple up in the hills, but the local giants would go in at night and throw away all the stonework. However, the temple was built, and still exists, made of the most beautiful marble. The skulls of five of the giants (brothers) are also supposed to be up in the bush. These are about a foot (30 centimeters) across.

North America

Eskimos: "In those days there were giants on the earth."

Montagnais Indians, Canada: “God was angry with the giants and sent a flood upon them.”

USA: Some Indian tribes worshipped "men of huge stature" who inhabited the region before they arrived. "A skeleton which is reported to have been of enormous dimensions" was found in a clay coffin, with a sandstone slab containing hieroglyphics, during mound explorations by a Dr. Everhart near Zanesville, Ohio. (American Antiquarian, v3, 1880, pg61)

Ten skeletons "of both sexes and of gigantic size" were taken from a mound at Warren, Minnesota, 1883. (St. Paul Pioneer Press, May 23, 1883)

A skeleton 7 feet 6 inches long was found in a massive stone structure that was likened to a temple chamber within a mound in Kanawha County, West Virginia, in 1884. (American Antiquarian, v6, 1884 133f. Cyrus Thomas, Report on Mound Explorations of the Bureau of Ethnology, 12th Annual Report, Smithsonian Bureau of Ethnology, 1890-91)

A large mound near Gasterville, Pennsylvania, contained a vault in which was found a skeleton measuring 7 feet 2 inches. Inscriptions were carved on the vault. (American Antiquarian, v7, 1885, 52f)

In 1885, miners discovered the mummified remains of woman measuring 6 feet 8 inches tall holding an infant. The mummies were found in a cave behind a wall of rock in the Yosemite Valley.

In Minnesota, 1888 were discovered remains of seven skeletons 7 to 8 feet tall. (St. Paul Pioneer Press, June 29, 1888)

A mound near Toledo, Ohio, held 20 skeletons, seated and facing east with jaws and teeth "twice as large as those of present day people," and besides each was a large bowl with "curiously wrought hieroglyphic figures." (Chicago Record, Oct. 24, 1895; cited by Ron G. Dobbins, NEARA Journal, v13, fall 1978

The skeleton of a huge man was uncovered at the Beckley farm, Lake Koronis, Minnesota; while at Moose Island and Pine City, bones of other giants came to light. (St. Paul Globe, Aug. 12, 1896)

In 1911, several red-haired mummies ranging from 6 and a half feet to 8 feet tall were discovered in a cave in Lovelock, Nevada.

In February and June of 1931, large skeletons were found in the Humboldt lake bed near Lovelock, Nevada. The first of these two skeletons found measured 8 1/2 feet tall and appeared to have been wrapped in a gum-covered fabric similar to the Egyptian manner. The second skeleton was almost 10 feet long. (Review - Miner, June 19, 1931)

A 7 foot 7 inch skeleton was reported to have been found on the Friedman ranch, near Lovelock, Nevada, in 1939.(Review - Miner, Sept. 29, 1939) In 1965, a skeleton measuring 8 feet 9 inches was found buried under a rock ledge along the Holly Creek in east-central Kentucky.

What the above means is that a remnant of a race of giants survived into the early 16th century (1519-1522). It gives full force and credit to other reported encounters with giants in the Americas, Europe, and the Middle East during that time period.

Supai Canyon, Arizona: A petroglyph depicting a mammoth attacking a man: the man must have been over 10 feet tall, according to the perspective employed by the ancient artist. (Indians in the vicinity stated that the drawings were made by giants of long ago.)

Central America

Axtec, Mexico: Before the Flood, the land was inhabited by the Tzocullixeco, a giant race. Xelua and his brother giants survived the world flood and built a pyramid to reach the clouds.

Toltec, Mexico: The "first age" was brought to an end by fearful destruction due to "floods and lightning," while in the "second age" our earth was peopled by giants, the Quinametzin.

Cholula Indians, Mexico: Before the great Flood which took place 4008 years after the creation of the world, the land was inhabited by giants.

Maya, Guatemala, Incas, and Peru: The first race created by the gods before the Flood were giants. Two prominent giants were Atlan [Atlas?] and Theitani [Titan?]

South America:

Peru: The Chavin people, whose civilization stretched from the Pacific Ocean to the sources of the Amazon, were giants. Also long ago a race of giant men came from the Pacific Ocean in ships, invaded the lowlands of old Peru, forcing the Inca high up into their mountain strongholds in the Andes. These giants were so huge that "from the knee down, they were as tall as a tall man.”

The city of Tiahuanaco in Bolivia was built by survivors of the Flood; it was built by giants.

As you see, the whole world appears to enshrine ancestral memories of giants.

A manuscript called The Apocalypse of Baruch, a pseudepigraphical work written around AD 100 and preserved only in the sixth-century Syriac Vulgate (and which seems a little unclear in parts) appears to hint at the origin of giants: "Men began as giants. These first giants were very highly developed, intellectually, artistically and physically: they had power over birds and animals… they misbehaved and were abolished by God, and ordinary men took their place…"

So many of the legends recall that mankind also lived far longer - even hundreds of years. From a high, blissful condition, man fell and steadily deteriorated. He was created with a noble physique and a powerful brain, which has degenerated through wrong living.

Other Giant Hominids

The 23 or so variations from the 'Family' of Hominids that have been identified, observed, photographed, or that have provided fossil proof of having lived (or are living) on or near the surface of Earth's biosphere, have about as much in common regarding DNA similarities as they have differences. The range is from about 40% up to 96% matching strings of DNA. In my opinion that is too large a number to be anything other than what it suggests.

ALL Hominins are more likely 'related' as Terrestrial inhabitants of this planet, than any other external origin hypothesis would support. You can argue individual specimens, but the preponderance of evidence supports at least 23 separate 'species'.

The following species have been seen and documented in multiple (hundreds to thousands) of eye-witness reports and or physical evidence including bone, skull, or fossil proof of their existence from the late Pleistocene, to late Holocene:

Neanderthal

Reconstruction: John Gurche; photograph: Tim Evanson, Licensed by Wikimedia Commons

A model of an adult Neanderthal male head and shoulders on display in the Hall of Human Origins in the Smithsonian Museum of Natural History in Washington, D.C. Reconstruction based on the Shanidar 1 fossil (c. 80-60 KYA). "“This is a complex being,” Gurche says of Neanderthal,

Homo neanderthalensis, who disappeared some 30,000 years ago after a nearly 200,000-year run. “Some people argue that Neanderthals were as sophisticated as we are.” They buried their dead and likely used pigments to decorate their bodies and clothes. This particular Neanderthal, Gurche points out, is the only hominid in the museum series that appears to have styled its hair.

Denisovan

No Photo Available

The Denisova Cave is located in southwestern Siberia, in the Altai Mountains near the border with China and Mongolia. It is named after Denis, a Russian hermit who lived there in the 18th century. The cave was originally explored in the 1970s by Russian paleontologist Nikolai Ovodov, who was looking for remains of cave bears. In 2008, Michael Shunkov from the Russian Academy of Sciences and other Russian archaeologists from the Institute of Archaeology and Ethnology of Novosibirsk investigated the cave.

They found the finger bone of a juvenile hominin, dubbed the "X woman" (referring to the maternal descent of mitochondrial DNA or the Denisova hominin. Artifacts, including a bracelet, excavated in the cave at the same level were carbon dated to around 40,000 BP. Excavations have since revealed human artifacts showing an intermittent presence going back 125,000 years.

Red Deer Cave People

In 1979, the partial skull of a cave dweller was found in Longlin Cave in the Guangxi Zhuang region of China. Further human remains were excavated from Maludong (Red Deer Cave) in Yunnan Province. Fossils of the Red Deer Cave dwellers were radiocarbon dated between 14,500 and 11,500 years of age, using charcoal found in the fossil deposits. During the period the Red Deer Cave people lived, all other prehistoric human species such as Neanderthals were thought to have died out. The Red Deer Cave hominids would therefore be more recent than homo floresiensis (dubbed "Hobbits") dated to 13,000 years ago.

Photo by Curnoe, D.; Xueping, J.; Herries, A. I. R.; Kanning, B.; Taçon, P. S. C.; Zhende, B.; Fink, D.; Yunsheng, Z.

Red Haired Giants

6 fingers, 6 toes - smallest of the known giants

Scientists are remaining stubbornly silent about a lost race of giants found in burial mounds near Lake Delavan, Wisconsin, in May 1912. The dig site at Lake Delavan was overseen by Beloit College and it included more than 200 effigy mounds that proved to be classic examples of 8th century Woodland Culture. But the enormous size of the skeletons and elongated skulls found in May 1912 did not fit very neatly into anyone's concept of a textbook standard. They were enormous. These were not average human beings.

Strange Skulls

The above photo is in the public domain.

Large Giants, 16' to 26' and Super Large Giants, up to 36'

Data and information on these giants is covered earlier in this chapter.

Elongated Giant Skulls

This photo © Marcin Ttochowiz, Used with permission

There seem to be three distinct types of long or elongated skulls. Each type has unique characteristics that define it specifically as a unique type. One is an ‘intentionally deformed’, bound and/or cradle boarded skull. Second is a “genetic deformity” caused by a medical condition called “Hydrocephalus” that exhibit characteristics common to that condition. The third are the “natural” elongated skulls that have significant increased cranial capacity and other characteristics that differentiate them from the other two types.

Much data and information is available on the web regarding the world-wide phenomenon of large, oversized giant elongated skulls which demonstrate different characteristics than ‘cradle-board’, de-formed or hydrocephalic skulls. Some skulls from Peru are currently being tested for DNA sequences to determine whether the skull belonged to any known race of hominids.

So far, preliminary tests on one or more of the skulls suggest its genome is significantly different than any known sequences of DNA in the global databases. Upon careful study of the available information, it seems to me that the “natural” large elongated skulls are a separate hominin species uniquely different than humans. They also appear to support researcher’s arguments that their species consisted of several different “racial” types, based on anatomical differences in different specimens.

Starchild Skull

Photos of the Starchild and a Human skull are used with permission from Lloyd Pye and the Starchild project.

The Starchild Skull is a 900 year old bone skull found in Mexico in the 1930s. The Skull has been tested and examined by various medical and scientific experts since 1999, and no condition or deformity has yet been identified that can explain its wide variety of abnormal characteristics.

Starchild Skull Tests Conducted Include:

CAT Scan, which proved the Skull was not deformed by abnormal fusion of the cranial sutures (the bone plates of the Starchild Skull are not stuck together in a way that stopped the skull growing properly and changed its shape)

X-Rays, which showed the bone of the Skull to be uniformly thinner than normal human bone, that it had no frontal sinuses, and that there was no fluid or other abnormality between the brain and the inside of the skull.

Scanning Electron Microscopy (SEM) Analysis discovered highly unusual microscopic fibers inside the bone of the Skull

Expert Analysis of the physical structure of the bone, which identified the bone as much thinner and lighter than normal human bone, but also discovered that it is much stronger than human bone, a feature possibly related to the fibers in the bone.

Birth defects across the entire occipital and parietal areas, while not impossible, seem highly unlikely because of the remarkable symmetry exhibited in all areas of the skull, including those affected by the deformations. The terrain of the bone in the eye sockets contains incredibly subtle indentations and ridges that are perfectly symmetrical in both sockets, which simply have to have been formed by genetic directions rather than by deformations.

The rear deformation extends from the crown to very near the foramen magnum, an area impossible to reach by any binding device due to the thick neck muscles (even in a child) that surround and support the skull-spine connection.

Head binding cannot extend below the inion (the bump at the back of the head). Head binding leaves a gaping opening at the top where skull bones fail to fuse.

DNA Analysis, which is preliminary and ongoing, has already uncovered both human and non-human DNA in the sample, and left experts optimistic that further testing will provide enough evidence to prove the Skull is a new species, or at least “different than human”.

Full Disclosure: Lloyd Pye was a close friend before his death in Dec. of 2013. He was in the process of writing this book with me prior to his sudden and fatal illness.

I did not agree with his analysis that the Starchild was a possible “Alien” or “Alien-Hybrid.” I argued with him that the Starchild Skull, much like the Elongated Skulls was certainly non-human, but were simply another terrestrial species of Hominins or Hominids. The argument for Other-Human is based on the fact that most all Flora and Fauna on Earth today, as well as those in the fossil record, show wide diversity in Species. It follows that Hominids (or Hominins) would logically follow Species diversity, with some or many different Species within the Genre of Hominids. A different 'Species' in the fossil record does NOT have to be 'Alien' to establish it as part of the biologial diversity of Earth. In fact, I further think that the concept of "Aliens' is just another 'Alternate Religion' based belief system that responds to Science's rejection of any information outside of its doctrine of gradualism-evolution.

Newspaper Clippings of Giants from Around the World.

Although these images are public domain, many of them are used with permission from the research and Facebook website of Micah E. Giantology. They are mostly without comment, as the content is self-explanatory. Micah has about 1,500 different pieces of information on his site, many of newspaper articles like these. Please go review his work.

Newspaper clippings are from respective newspaper archives, and from the public domain, and/or from, the Mica Giantology Facebook page, which are used with permission.






Giants and Megaliths

Megalithic construction requires a 'motive' process that appears to be well beyond the functional physical limitations of modern humans. Though when the reality of Giant hominid capabilities (in terms of weight to strength ratios) are applied to the motive problem, it nearly disappears.

First it is necessary to understand the nature of the physical increases in strength between different sizes of humans. The best evidence is from the Guinness Book of World Records regarding the 'World's Tallest “Natural Giant” in Recorded History', Angus Mackaskill, a Scotsman from Burneray, who lived from 1825 to 1863. He was a 'true' giant, meaning he was of normal proportions, suffering no abnormalities. He was 7' 9” tall and weighed just over 500 lbs.

Photo composite © John Jensen

His strength was legendary, and he is reported to have lifted and easily carried a ship's anchor weighing 2,300 lbs. the length of the dock. Many other instances are recorded of Angus carrying individual 300 lbs. loggerhead barrels under each arm. Based on eye witness testimony, it is reasonable to assume that he could lift and easily carry more than the average of 1.5 times his body weight. That ratio of height to strength means an increase of roughly 28% in body height results in a 250% increase in body weight and muscle mass. Using the standard model of 150% of body weight as lifting capacity, his strength (lift weight) limit can be easily determined at about 750 lbs. This means that a 10’ tall giant would weigh roughly 1,275 lbs. and would have a lifting capacity of about 1,912 lbs. While a 12'4” giant would weigh about 3,200 lbs. with a lifting capacity of about 4,820 lbs., which is about 2.5 tons. At that rate 25 giants could lift 100 ton, and 250 could lift 1000 ton.

Megalithic stone blocks that weighed more than 1000 ton could potentially be managed with as few as 250 (12') giants even if they had no more technical or mechanical support than ropes, slings, and pulleys. Of course, if the giants had minimal levels of some kinds of technical or mechanical support, the largest trilithon blocks might have been moved by a significantly fewer number of movers.

A mechanical rigging engineer can explain the rudiments of moving dead weight with little more than serious rigging (block and tackle systems). 'The Thunder Stone', is the largest single block of stone in the modern era to have been moved by human power alone. The Thunder Stone is a single monolith weighing over 1,200 ton, used as the base for the statue of Peter the Great in St. Petersburg, Russia. It was moved several miles in under 9 months, with a crew of 400 odd workers, and no horses or machinery, just block and tackle rigging and large caster ball bearings mounted on a section of sleds.

This photo licensed from Wikimedia Commons.

Without making any unnecessary claims, the 20 or so Old Testament references to several dozen different giants and remnants of giants, as well as clans and tribes, is historically accurate, because the city of Bashan with 10' doorways and 12' tall rooms is standing proof of those claims. What you have is historical (Old Testament) records of Giants, (OG, King of Bashan, and Goliath and his 4 siblings 400 years later), and actual Archaeological remains of entire cities, from Bashan to the megalithic ruins of Baalbek, and Solomon's Temple in Jerusalem indicating that giants, their cities and their megalithic stonework were more likely than not, a historical fact in the region of the Golan Heights.

What is also interesting in this light is that Mount Hermon in the Bashan district was a major religious center before Jerusalem was organized as the seat of King David’s empire. In addition, the ancient platforms of Baalbek are less than 30 miles north of the city of Bashan.

Also, it is noteworthy that the great cut and worked stone building materials of Bashan, as well as the giant stones of Baalbek and the megaliths under Solomon's Temple in Jerusalem have many of the same characteristics. That is, they are very large, well dressed and put in place with an accuracy that is as advanced as modern stone cutting capabilities.

It has often been speculated by non-biblical theorists, that the stones were moved by “…. Extraterrestrials or by Giants….” The historical records support ‘Giants’ as the most likely answer.

Photo reproduction is from Wikimedia Commons, used with permission.

The specific information regarding historical references to the Giants of the Old Testament seems to be as accurate and compelling as any ancient document, and seems to have much factual data that can be verified outside the boundaries of faith and prejudice.

What it tells us is that a descendant race of Giants lived around the Golan Heights within the historical record, they built megalithic (surviving) cities in the Bashan region, and they or their pre-catastrophic predecessors (Nephilim) were involved in the building of local megalithic sites like the Temple base at Baalbek and the Temple base in Jerusalem.

This photo licensed from Wikimedia Commons.

This discussion is narrowly focused on the factors relating to moving the blocks from their quarry beds. The first quarry is about a quarter mile downhill away from the site, and the other is about 2 miles distant across rugged terrain. I do not approach the technical nature of cutting and releasing the stones from their quarry bed.

That discussion, when broached, should include a review of the large circular cutting-abrasion patterns that can still be seen in the quarry, as well as those visible on some of the unfinished stones. (Please note the long upward angled pattern grooves in the upper right section of the block. Those appear to be regular stone cutting saw marks.)

Conclusion to Giants in the Historical Record

What the evidence seems to indicate is: Originally, "there were giants." Their intellect and physical powers remains legendary. They built colossal megalithic buildings, cities, towns, roads, and walls (enclosures), they may have had other forms of advanced technology, though all that remains of their technology is very large stone artifacts, some primitive tools, and skeletal - funerary remains. It seems that the earliest megalithic remnants appear to be the most sophisticated, with the largest and best dressed megaliths at or near the bottom of ancient construction, with newer materials, both smaller and less sophisticated are built over and on top of the larger stones.

This photo is from the Mica E. Giantology website and is used with permission.

It is rational to conclude, that if very large dinosaurs lived alongside giant humans, the size disparity between them would preclude carnivorous dinosaurs from hunting giant hominids to extinction. An example is that the largest T-Rex stood around 18' tall. If a hominid was significantly taller, then the T Rex was probably not hunting that particular giant hominid. At least it was a more 'equal' fight for survival, with the giant hominid would have had a significant advantage.

A series, over time of global Super Cataclysm disasters wiped out that original world, and drastically altered the topography, fertility, climate and Electrostatic Density (G force) of the planet, reducing over time all previous (giant) flora and fauna including dinosaurs and hominids.

Over time those disasters left surviving 'groups' of hominids in isolation from each other in specific 'pockets' around the world. Based on Haplogroup X markers, O-neg blood type, and linguistic roots, the related areas and groups are; The North Berbers of the Atlas range, Canary Islanders, the Basque, the Druze of Lebanon, the Celts, the Sumerians, as well as other groups in Kashmir, Western China, the Gobi, North America, South America, and areas of the Pacific rim.

In the impoverished environment which followed the last Super Catastrophe 7,000 years ago, degeneration was accelerated. However, for some time there persisted a significant, though decreasing proportion of hominids who retained enormous stature. It is a possibility that remnants of those giants still exist today as Bigfoot, Sasquatch, Alma, etc.

From the records on Giants, there seems to be several different form characteristics, with three distinguishing features. The first is that some earlier ancestor giants were not only of giant stature, but also long lived, with lifespans several times that of modern humans. Others, descendants of the original Nephilim, 'devolved' or degenerated to what seems to be a larger form of marginal Neanderthals. And last there appears to be significantly different body sizes and types. One feature is that 'some' specific (but not all) giants had 6 fingers and 6 toes, and a double row of teeth. This distinctive trait is seen from reports all over the world. Another trait is that 'some' (but not all) giants were 'red skinned or red men', and some had red or russet hair.

The most significant characteristic is the difference in size range. Using the historical record, the size range of the mid current Holocene Epoch, giants and their predecessors were 9' to 16' in height. That is for the giants that we have specific records of. (OG the king of Bashan) was a little over 12' tall. About 400 years later, the general size had been reduced to between 9' and 10.5” (Goliath and his brothers), which suggests a significant 'survivable' population. Average size of the giants up through the post Colombian era seems to be about 7.5' to 10' tall. This group includes the Patagonian Giants and other North and South American giants.

Conglomerate Graphic image © John Jensen, 2014

The above information is taken from historical records. There are thousands of additional records of various giants found in all kinds of circumstances, with various degrees of photographic or other recorded support over the last 2,500 years. It is not the intention of this chapter to add information that is widely available elsewhere on the internet. The purpose of this chapter is to look at the historical records, and determine if the credible testimony contained in that record will substantiate the existence of giants in our current Epoch. The facts demonstrate that giants lived in and near the City of Bashan and Mt Hermon. It is historically recorded they were hunted to near extinction by Moses and Joshua. The city of Bashan stands in mute testimony to their presence.

The evidence for Giants in our Epoch, indicates they are descendants from a race of Giants that co-existed with Modern Humans, Cro Magnon, Neanderthals and other hominid species prior to the Last Great Cataclysm of 7,000 years ago. They, like other giant flora and fauna declined in stature, and finally went nearly extinct as a species sometime in the last 1,500 years, with very few remote and isolated pockets, like the Patagonia Giants surviving into a post Columbian period.

As a final note, I would include the distinct possibility that one or more of the 6 cataclysms during the last 15,000 years of the post ice age included a drastic increase in the 'G' force of this planet, thereby causing the extinction of most giant flora and fauna, including giant human. If that is the case, it would explain 'blood and tissue' remains in various non-fossilized dinosaur bones where more than 360 of those remains have been 14c (AMS) tested, returning dates of between 12,000 and 42,000 YBP. More than 300 of those tests have been done in Russia and the Orient.



Javier Moreno

Product Development Consulting, Program/Project Management, Supply Change Contracts Management, Outsourcing Development and Technical Sales.

5y

John. Interesting subject, I probably agree with everything you wrote except the numbers - But to my knowledge there are no Records that indicate that giants from the Last Great Cataclysm were between 16' and 24' tall (5 to 7 meters). Meganthropus (Giant Orangutan). I understand is the biggest hominid at 3 meters (10 ft), A Brown Alaskan Bear and the very improbable Sasquatch are 3 meters. So yes, since differences arise in the past due to isolation and enviromental factors an hominid population of standard size of 3 meters, should be a separate hominid species. In my opinion the problem with big thick bones, like Castelnau-le-Lez, France, is that people assume same proportions as todays human, so we see 3.5 meters, in what should be more like 3 meters. Giants need to be massive in order to support their weitht. if you want to get a picture of a proportional Giant you can see the Giants of Game of Thrones (affectionaed Wun Wun). Regarding Nephilims, Titans and Egyptians Giants (Atlanteans) we have very little evidence, Egyptians Giants (Hatshepsut, Sanakht) are 6 ft tall (1.80m), giants, for their time but tall people today, and those giants seem to be a story of consanguineous (incestuous) marriages. Giants today tend to be bigger than the reality. The problem with written records is the tendency of fans to exagerate their heroes size as is noticed by the UFC and MMA fighters size in internet forums. The Second problem in the Stakeholders tendency to do the same, so WWE - World Wrestling Entertainment billed vs Real height differ in todays easy to check internet world, so Giant Gonzales is not 8 ft but 7'4" and The Rock is not 6'5" but 6'3". Titus Flavius Josephus the Roman Historian says about the Philistine giant Goliath that is "four cubits and a span" 6 feet 9 inches about the height of the James Comey under 2 meters not 3 meters. Were the original personage that constructed the story of Adam and Noah, 15ft and 13 ft tall? as some people estimate, who knows.  As we go back in in time 2K (Abraham), 4K (Noah), 6K (Adam), 8K and 10K BC(before Jesus) through the Ages of Taurus, Gemini, Cancer and Leo. Less and Less evidence we have of human population. It appears that the human population sudden declined 12,000 years ago due to Astronomical Catastrophic Causes of Global Impact. Until we can have more evidence we have a plausible evidence of Giants of 3 meters tall, a decline in height from 3 to 2 meters, actually agriculture made 1.5 meter the standard height. But in any case I do follow and understand and believe your statements, but we have not a compelling evidence of 5 or 7 meters tall hominids on the Leo Age (10,000 Before Jesus).

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